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Post by Alyssa on Dec 6, 2011 23:34:27 GMT -5
Texas mother shoots kids, kills self after being denied food stamps (VIDEO)A Texas mother who barricaded herself in a state welfare office for seven hours before shooting her two children and killing herself had reportedly been denied food stamps for months. The children, a 10-year-old boy and a 12-year-old girl, remained in critical condition at a San Antonio hospital on Tuesday, the LA Times reported, quoting Joe Baeza, a Laredo Police Department investigator. The mother was identified as Rachelle Grimmer, 38, and children Ramie and Timothy, The Associated Press reported. Baeza reportedly said that they had recently moved to the border city from Zanesville, Ohio, about 30 miles east of Columbus. Grimmer's first application for food stamps in July was denied because she didn't turn in enough information, the AP quoted Texas Department of Health and Human Services spokeswoman Stephanie Goodman as saying. read more: www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/americas/united-states/111206/texas-laredo-food-stamps-mother-kills-children
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Post by Alyssa on Dec 6, 2011 23:35:03 GMT -5
This is really sad. After reading the story, there still isn't enough information as to what led up to this. she applied, she didn't make her appointment, case was closed, then reopened.
Maybe she didn't have the money to get to the office that day. Who knows, but I'm sure the welfare office gave her a hard time because they did the same with a friend of mine that was about to become homeless.
They told her to fill out the forms, she did. Then they sent here a letter telling her they needed more information, she complied. They set up and appointment for her to come in, she did. she was denied. Now she's homeless and on the streets and I lost contact with her.
Welfare offices do give people a very hard time, some more than others. I couldn't help but think that if she had a white case worker, she would have gotten services, but the black lady that was handling her case in Los Angeles was a real bytch and thought she was god and made my friend feel like lower than life.
I can see why this woman did what she did. I suppose it was better to put her and her kids out of the misery of having to beg and live on the streets.
Things like this should not be happening here in America. If a man and woman can get 1200 a month in welfare assistance and live in a 1.2 million dollar home, then this woman deserved help if she needed it. do people really need to become homeless and digging in the trash before they can receive any help? Hell no! They should be helped before it reaches that point imo.
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 8, 2011 13:18:03 GMT -5
THis is sad, when there are Churches, and many food pantries that would have helped her..
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Post by Ladyblue on Dec 8, 2011 16:44:03 GMT -5
WE cant judge or say what or how her mind was when it happen, its a sad thing...........................nothing would of help her.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 13, 2011 8:23:09 GMT -5
That is not true, there is always hope.... and yes it is sad that this happened. Those kids deserved a future even if their mother could not seek help
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 13, 2011 12:43:51 GMT -5
I can't judge her? The hell I can't judge her. She SHOT her children. Two defenseless little ones who God blessed her with and she SHOT them? You damn right I can judge her. She could have taken those babies to a police station, to the welfare office, to a hospital...a number of places and dropped them off to be taken care of. Is this a perfect solution? Of course not but it beats shooting your own children. This is never acceptable. I don't care what the reason was.
Yes. The assistance programs are arduous. There is a bunch of paperwork and requirements. It has to be that way. Otherwise, people who have plenty of money could just go down and get them. These resources aren't endless, you know. There has to be some way of finding the truly needy and weeding out the people who aren't. And still mistakes are made. The undeserving win sometimes. And, yes. Sometimes the people working there aren't so pleasant. I challenge anyone to sit there, day after day, trying to do your job while you are called all sorts of names, theatened, and lied to by people. Especially when a good majority of those people are just too friggin lazy to go out and work and want everything handed to them. Not all of them, but a bunch of them. Can't feed your children? Welllllllll. Just go get pregnant and have another then. Until you've walked in those shoes, YOU can't judge.
She evidently had the money to buy a damn gun! Probably could have fed her kids for a month on what she spent on that gun and the ammunition.
And if any of you "can understand" why she did this? Please get yourself sterilized immediately. If you already have kids? Please take them to the nearest person who "understands" the value of children.
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Post by Alyssa on Dec 13, 2011 18:13:57 GMT -5
That is not true, there is always hope.... and yes it is sad that this happened. Those kids deserved a future even if their mother could not seek help Nanna, I think it has to do with her trying to get assistance and being denied over and over again. We have a system that is pretty much lame when it comes to the welfare assistance for those in need. They won't help you if you own certain things of values, and I believe this woman would rather see her kids die than digging out of the trash searching for food, or have them sleeping on a park bench somewhere, not to mention that if she lost her residence and was on the streets, the system would take her kids away from her, but not help them as a family. Why does one have to become homeless and destitute before getting some aide. We should be helping them so they won't reach the point of homelessness and made to beg for help. The system for aiding those in need is broken and in dire need of reform. Yes it is sad that she did what she did, but we did not walk in her shoes, nor do we know the full extent on what she was dealing with. Watch a film called God Bless the Child. The kids could get better assistance and help if the mother would abandon her, but they would not give her the assistance she needed while she was living with her mother. It's a great film, and be sure to have some Kleenex next to you. You are going to need them.
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 13, 2011 20:18:41 GMT -5
Martini, I understand what you are saying, however, she murdered her kids. I agree with Snow.. she could have given them up and let them be adopted out instead of killing them.
There are resources out there and I have to wonder did she do all she could to get help. I would have to say she didn't.
It is very sad that her choice was a permanent solution to a temporary problem.
Look at the depression years, people made it and they didn't kill themselves and their kids.
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Post by Alyssa on Dec 13, 2011 20:30:26 GMT -5
Martini, I understand what you are saying, however, she murdered her kids. I agree with Snow.. she could have given them up and let them be adopted out instead of killing them. There are resources out there and I have to wonder did she do all she could to get help. I would have to say she didn't. It is very sad that her choice was a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Look at the depression years, people made it and they didn't kill themselves and their kids. Hi Nanna, the depression years were much different than today. Back then the population was way much smaller than it is today, and today, we have way more people and not enough resources for them all. I think we shouldn't allow people to reach thos point to where they end up killing their kids as in this case. The people should be helped as she was trying to get it before they became homeless, destitute, and on the streets looking for food and a bench to sleep on. Apparently the SW that took her to a back office was giving h=this woman a hard time and she was getting desperate for help. All we have now is what the SW has to say, but I know from people I worked with in California, some of these SW are azzholes and make it extremely difficult for anyone to get the assistance. The same with SS, VA, and SSI recipients. I worked with people that were given a very hard time to get their SS or SSI benefits all because the people at the SS kept telling them they need more information, or we lost your files, call this number, and so on. They discourage people and make them feel like low-life degenerates in some cases. The SW in this case should have given her a list of referrals for shelter, food, medical and whatever she and her kids needed help with. I think this whole massacre would have never happened if the SW treated this woman with some respect instead of treating her like a lower than life human being, and yes, when dealing with the Welfare office, they make some people feel really bad about themselves for just coming into the office and it shouldn't be that way. People should be helped before they become homeless and on the streets, not afterwards.
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Post by Ladyblue on Dec 13, 2011 22:03:18 GMT -5
I agree Martini, Respect , being depression she didnt know what to do.....................have never felt like that so to judge her is wroug, I feel sorry and sad that she felt she had to do what she did..................
And if any of you "can understand" why she did this? Please get yourself sterilized immediately. If you already have kids? Please take them to the nearest person who "understands" the value of children
Wow...............like I said dont even walk in her shoes..............................................SAD I can see where the hate comes from..............people like u Cold Stone Cold
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 14, 2011 8:38:47 GMT -5
Martini, there are so many sources available here in Texas, there are shelters everywhere, churches, they would and COULD have helped her.
One thing is where is the dad? Child support? It is very easy to get a Lonestar card (food stamps, medical as well)
If I was this desperate, I would give my kids up before killing them. Those kids deserved to have a life.
Blue, you would argue the color of the moon with anyone you disagree with. You expect me or anyone to honestly beleive you think what this woman did was reasonable and ok? No, you don't.. but because I and Snow are speaking out against it, you go the different direction.
It is sick to think you agree with murder.
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 14, 2011 8:40:27 GMT -5
I think we shouldn't allow people to reach thos point to where they end up killing their kids as in this case.Martini, please tell me this is a typo because you cannot really mean and beleive we should ALLOW people to kill their kids when they become homeless? ? No only is this sick and irrational, but MURDER.
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Post by Alyssa on Dec 14, 2011 9:29:47 GMT -5
Yes it most definitely was a typo Nanna, and I have corrected it. Thanks for seeing that.
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 14, 2011 9:39:00 GMT -5
Thank God.. It freaked me out!
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 14, 2011 9:46:28 GMT -5
I suppose that's true. I am stone cold when it comes to things like this. I have ZERO sympathy with anyone who harms children. Typical bleeding heart liberal mentality. Blame everybody else but who did it. Don't blame the whacko that shot her kids. Don't ever make people take responsibility for their own behavior. That's exactly why this country is in the shape it's in.
I don't have to walk in her shoes to know that was she did was unforgiveable. You can boo hoo all you want and shake your fist at "the man" till it falls off. Doesn't change what she did and doesn't excuse it.
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 14, 2011 9:49:40 GMT -5
I haven't read anything else on this story because it makes me sick. Last report I read was that the babies were in the hospital in critical condition. How about you go there and look into their little frightened, hurt eyes and tell them you aren't going to judge their mother and that you can understand why she did this.
Maybe you can poke a finger into their bullet wounds, too.
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Post by Alyssa on Dec 14, 2011 10:16:42 GMT -5
Thank God.. It freaked me out! It freaked me out when you saw that too. Thanks again for pointing that out Nanna. HAGD
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Post by Alyssa on Dec 14, 2011 10:31:04 GMT -5
I suppose that's true. I am stone cold when it comes to things like this. I have ZERO sympathy with anyone who harms children. Typical bleeding heart liberal mentality. Blame everybody else but who did it. Don't blame the whacko that shot her kids. Don't ever make people take responsibility for their own behavior. That's exactly why this country is in the shape it's in. I don't have to walk in her shoes to know that was she did was unforgivable. You can boo hoo all you want and shake your fist at "the man" till it falls off. Doesn't change what she did and doesn't excuse it. You are entitled to your feelings and views Snow Angel. A lot of people are disgusted with what happened here, and yes, these kids, if they survive will have a hard road to travel as they will begin to try and understand as to why their mom did this to them and to herself. I don't think anyone can really understand what she was thinking or what she was going through in dealing with the Welfare system. What is done is done and there is no turning back the clock or time. We all should just try and understand and try to understand the word empathy and explore it. I like to look at all angels of the story and the situation. As I compare this to a friend of mine when I lived in Californian, she had lost her job, and was about to lose everything and applied for some welfare assistance. They gave her the runaround for weeks. We packed up all her belongings and put them in a storage facility where she lost everything because should couldn't make the payments on her storage. After that, I and others lost contact with her and never heard from her again. I believe the Welfare system should help people before they come homeless and destitute. The welfare system really does need to be overhauled and restructured so people can get help right away instead of being made to jump through hoops and treated like a third class citizen. I witnessed first hand on how they treated my friend that needed assistance. She would cry, talk about suicide and such, and that is not the way it should be. These people at the welfare offices are suppose to be educated and able to see the desperation in people that are in need of help instead of making them jump through hoops and turning them away. Yes the mother was very wrong in what she did in shooting her kids and herself, but the welfare office is just as wrong for not seeing that this woman was in need of help, both mentally and financially so her and her kids wouldn't end up on the streets or eating out of the garbage for a meal.
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 14, 2011 11:02:09 GMT -5
I suppose that's true. I am stone cold when it comes to things like this. I have ZERO sympathy with anyone who harms children. Typical bleeding heart liberal mentality. Blame everybody else but who did it. Don't blame the whacko that shot her kids. Don't ever make people take responsibility for their own behavior. That's exactly why this country is in the shape it's in. I don't have to walk in her shoes to know that was she did was unforgiveable. You can boo hoo all you want and shake your fist at "the man" till it falls off. Doesn't change what she did and doesn't excuse it. Snow, I couldn't have said it better. I don't care how homeless and broke a mother is, there is NEVER a reason to kill a child, never. This country is in trouble, because we have reared up people that think Government is suppose to take care of them. If my Grandmother and Great Grandmother were alive today.. and seeing all the whining about having no food, they would slap them out of it. These great people that I loved knew how to make anything out of flour, ring a chickens neck, pluck it, cut it up, cook it. They didn't have the luxery of indoor plumbing or running water. Oh, and they had husbands that stuck around and worked their fingers to the bone to survive. People need to learn how to survive off the land.. And Snow you are right, Liberals blame everyone but themselves.
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 14, 2011 11:13:40 GMT -5
Of course it's awful that the woman couldn't receive the help she needed. But it's not the fault of the "welfare office". There are State rules and laws they have to follow, just like everybody else in any other job. They have to follow the rules they are given. And yes. You are correct. An overhaul is needed - no question about that. But at this point, it's all we have.
There is help "right now", Martini. There are any number of shelters, food pantries, churches, etc. I know because I volunteer at them all the time, so don't tell me I don't have empathy. Instead of railing at the system, I actually go out and try to do something about it. I know that's not a perfect solution. But it is a solution in the short term. I dont' know what it's like to be hungry and homeless. I have always supported myself with, thank God, no need for assistance from anyone. But I can damn sure tell you that even if I was, I couldn't shoot a kid.
Contrary to popular belief, these people that work at the public assistance offices don't just sit around deciding who they can screw with today. They don't sit there and tee-hee at that woman who can't feed her kids. They probably did see that she was in dire need, but there wasn't anything they could do about it. Write your Senators and your Representatives. Tell them you want to see change. But dont' blame people who are getting paid minimum wage and can barely feed THEIR children for just doing their jobs.
I do have empathy, Martini, but I have it for the ones who deserve it. The children. Period. We have become, as a society, so accepting of atrocities. I don't understand it. A serial killer kills 25 women and we bemoan his terrible childhood. A mother drowns her four children and we lambaste the husband "who should have seen it coming". A man beats the hell out of his wife and we blame her for not leaving sooner.
When are we going to hold people responsible for their own actions? It's that mother's fault and nobody else's. She had other alternatives.
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 14, 2011 12:29:34 GMT -5
Update: Both of the children are dead.
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 14, 2011 14:28:38 GMT -5
Post #19 Snow, exactly.. I also have volunteered at these places.. and there is so much help for people who need it....
If it were me and I had 2 little one's, I as their mother, would do anything and everything to make sure we stayed together and survived. I would never give up and never stop trying.. any good mother would.
I am also sick of everyone blaming everyone else for their problems.. No one is responsible anymore for their actions, and its always because of "something" so we need to overlook the murders they committ... Horse crap!
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 14, 2011 14:50:04 GMT -5
Horse crap, indeed, Nana. Here are a couple of other things I found during my reading.
EMERGENCY benefits were denied the woman because of her SELF reported income. Her SELF reported income exceeded her SELF reported expenses. That means she was bringing in more money than she was sending out. You can't get emergency benefits when you have that.
Her later benefits were NOT denied. They simply asked for proof of how much child support she was receiving. A simple copy of a check. She never provided that proof. Evidently, it is much easier to kill your two beautiful babies than it is to take in the copy of a check.
In addition? There was a father involved who paid child support regularly. According to the mother, he wasn't a good resource because he was a "Russian spy and a member of the KKK". So dead kids are better than kids with their daddy.
Finally, in her 7 hour stand off where she held people HOSTAGE, the office told her they had approved her benefits and slipped proof in the form of $3050.00 underneath the door she was holding her children in. In response? She hung up the phone and killed her kids and herself.
None of that sounds like the welfare office's fault to me.
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 14, 2011 14:53:09 GMT -5
Good Grief.. she was nuts!
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 14, 2011 15:15:18 GMT -5
In addition, the story I read said that the mother lived a nomadic existence with her children and had never worked or even attempted to work. Ever.
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Post by Ladyblue on Dec 14, 2011 16:32:29 GMT -5
Whatever..........................lol life goes on...................................................................
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Post by Ladyblue on Dec 14, 2011 16:33:06 GMT -5
Im could of would of,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,move on...
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 14, 2011 17:09:13 GMT -5
Whatever..........................lol life goes on................................................................... Really? Laughing about two dead children? Life doesn't go on for them.
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Post by Snow Angel on Dec 14, 2011 17:16:18 GMT -5
Im could of would of,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,move on... Huh? Put down the bottle and sloooooowly step away from your computer.
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Post by gavinsnana on Dec 14, 2011 18:19:41 GMT -5
Whatever..........................lol life goes on................................................................... What??? LOL life goes on? Wish I could say that for those poor kids
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